Israel [Zionists] bomb Beirut in Lebanon and assassinated صالح العاروري Salih Al3aruri

@savage_caveman
1. Words have different meaning based on where they are used.
2. The war started 1948, but people like you with close minds refused to see anything of the genocide happening and decided to open your eyes the day the ones being oppressed decided to strike back and called them terrorists. Again can you prove it was hamas who killed civilians in 7th October

Let's put this to clear
Hating zionists ≠ hating jews
Anti semitism is both on Arabs and jews Arabs are also semits so I suggest you replace the word anti semitism with anti jews or something like that
Criticizing the inhumane things the idf comits isn't being anti jews, it is being pro humanity.
Hating the ones who killed 20k innocent has nothing to do with them being jews or aliens or whatever, it has to do with their actions
People who defend Palestine are not nazis
Nazi isn't about being a human, nazi is about genocide, and again I compared earlier what the idf does to what Nazis did to jews

@sdkman said in #31:
> @savage_caveman
> 1. Words have different meaning based on where they are used.
> 2. The war started 1948, but people like you with close minds refused to see anything of the genocide happening and decided to open your eyes the day the ones being oppressed decided to strike back and called them terrorists. Again can you prove it was hamas who killed civilians in 7th October

www.hrw.org/news/2023/10/18/israel/palestine-videos-hamas-led-attacks-verified
www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181
apnews.com/article/sexual-assault-hamas-oct-7-attack-rape-bb06b950bb6794affb8d468cd283bc51
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_and_gender-based_violence_in_the_7_October_attack_on_Israel

These are just a few. There are no reliable independent news sources that support your claim that hamas did not attack civilians on Oct 7th. Denying that fact makes it hard to accept anything else you say.

@Mopman
have you gave a chance that hamas is innocent
When you accuse someone of something without listening to what that person sais is unfair
I recommend you search what they have to say about these
Ps:Not as If the idf never faked hamas before lmao

@sdkman said in #35:
> @Mopman
> have you gave a chance that hamas is innocent
> When you accuse someone of something without listening to what that person sais is unfair
> I recommend you search what they have to say about these
> Ps:Not as If the idf never faked hamas before lmao

The reports being made are not from the idf they are independent. And the deaths did happen. Occam's razor would lead to the people responsible being those who attacked ( and you agree hamas did attack on Oct 7th ).

@Mopman said in #36:
> The reports being made are not from the idf they are independent. And the deaths did happen. Occam's razor would lead to the people responsible being those who attacked ( and you agree hamas did attack on Oct 7th ).
There are two points I want to cover
The first being that there are many armed groups on the land, if you cannot or don't have the time to watch what hamas said, summary of all the interviews was that there are other armed groups __they refused to disclose their names__ who comited it, they also said that the kills done were not ordered nor planed, aka the kills done by hamas were not their original plan but the circumstances of the fight led to that, another thing they didn't cover but I want to add is that it is possible that a few members disobeyed the orders and attacked civilians, just a personal thought, another theory of the helicopter which is probably wrong, but some deaths by friendly fire is possible, and not the first time it happens, the 3 hostages who got killed by solders of the idf, or in the past when they attacked hamas members leading to civilian casualties by friendly fire, in summary not all the deaths are cause by Hamas
The second point is that in war there is no black and white, both parties comit some level of crimes, it is inevitable, but the difference is that one comits them in a disproportionate way and on perpous using excuses to uustify it and the other one who was oppressed and decided to fight back
Edit: a third point bring hamas needs national support, they won't be doing something that will lose it to them aspecially if it doesn't offer any advantage, like literally if you hate them or not, you must admit they are smart, otherwise they wouldn't be standing with nothing against the strongest army, and for them an alive hostage is better then a dead one, they benefit absolutely nothing from killing civilians so why would they do it, in fact it would be more disadvantageous to them since they would lose support, and hamas are muslims after all and in Islam it is haram to kill innocents, if they believe in Islam they wouldn't kill

@sdkman said in #37:
> There are two points I want to cover
> The first being that there are many armed groups on the land, if you cannot or don't have the time to watch what hamas said, summary of all the interviews was that there are other armed groups __they refused to disclose their names__ who comited it, they also said that the kills done were not ordered nor planed, aka the kills done by hamas were not their original plan but the circumstances of the fight led to that, another thing they didn't cover but I want to add is that it is possible that a few members disobeyed the orders and attacked civilians, just a personal thought, another theory of the helicopter which is probably wrong, but some deaths by friendly fire is possible, and not the first time it happens, the 3 hostages who got killed by solders of the idf, or in the past when they attacked hamas members leading to civilian casualties by friendly fire, in summary not all the deaths are cause by Hamas
> The second point is that in war there is no black and white, both parties comit some level of crimes, it is inevitable, but the difference is that one comits them in a disproportionate way and on perpous using excuses to uustify it and the other one who was oppressed and decided to fight back

That is was not the original plan but the circumstances that led to it is difficult to defend since we are talking about civilians.
It is possible that it was a few ( quite a few based on the deaths ) members disobeyed and attacked civilians but since they were under the command of Hamas then they must accept that responsibility or at the very least charge and arrest those members and then publish that information.
( ignoring helicopter since you agree that is not likely )
There certainly could have been friendly fire but the numbers of dead do not really add up to that since if you are shooting at enemy combatants you do not fire into crowds of fleeing civilians.
Disproportionate response. Can you say with absolute certainty that given the firepower and ability Hamas would not do the same thing to Israel that is happening to Gaza?

@Mopman said in #38:
> That is was not the original plan but the circumstances that led to it is difficult to defend since we are talking about civilians.
> It is possible that it was a few ( quite a few based on the deaths ) members disobeyed and attacked civilians but since they were under the command of Hamas then they must accept that responsibility or at the very least charge and arrest those members and then publish that information.
We can clear up the original plan wasn't to kill civilians because they don't benefit from it
Take example the dancing party or festival
If they targeted it they would take the short path not the long one
But ignoring that point, there are still many armed groups as I said
Not only hamas
The kills might have been done by these which is very likely
Or as I said the civilians were in the middle of a confrontation
> ( ignoring helicopter since you agree that is not likely )
> There certainly could have been friendly fire but the numbers of dead do not really add up to that since if you are shooting at enemy combatants you do not fire into crowds of fleeing civilians.
Comes the other armed groups part
There is nothing clear on what happened
And certainly we will know more
If it was members who disobeyed we will see Hamas show them and punish them
Other armed groups we will see
But we can't blame it all on Hamas because as I said it is claim vs claim
> Disproportionate response. Can you say with absolute certainty that given the firepower and ability Hamas would not do the same thing to Israel that is happening to Gaza?
We are talking 20k person for 1k person that is only after Oct 7th
That is ignoring the events that happened before
That is ignoring the deaths of civilians the idf made before the 7th Oct
That is ignoring the hostages the idf has of Palestinians kids and women ...
We are only talking about after the 7th Oct and it is 1k vs 20k and it is still continuing
And yet again the idf failed miserably against Hamad
Their attacks only affect civilians
The only way to get back hostages is negotiations

Disproportionate response. Can you say with absolute certainty that given the firepower and ability Hamas would not do the same thing to Israel that is happening to Gaza?

In war all humans will use the weapons they have, unless they fear retaliation.
No nation, creed or faith is immune to this.